Speaker 1: 0:00

Welcome everybody. Sorry about having a break last week. My trial schedule just got too much. I wasn't able to spend the time that I wanted to to have a podcast episode last week, so hopefully you enjoyed hearing from Linda again. I think that was a kind of an interesting episode that has information that comes up a lot. It's kind of a difficult thing to think about that high conflict communication.

Speaker 1: 0:28

Today we're going to continue talking about separation anxiety in kids. Last time we talked about anxiety generally in kids, kind of had a bit of a deep dive into what it is. Today I want to focus on separation anxiety in children, especially during visitation transfers. Today I want to focus on separation anxiety in children, especially during visitation transfers, and I'll give you sort of a look ahead. There are a lot of parallels to any sort of separation anxiety Separation anxiety and visitation transfers for kids of separated parents. It's not like that's a totally unique thing. It's another instance in which that anxiety that they're feeling is expressed. You'll see similar anxiety for kids when things like school drop-offs One of the questions that I tend to ask if I'm the parent coordinator or a guardian ad litem or the attorney in the case and I'm being told that the child has extreme separation anxiety and so they shouldn't see the other parent.

Speaker 1: 1:24

One of the first questions that I have is well, do they show anxiety in other circumstances as well? We're going to talk today about that, about separation anxiety in kids. It doesn't necessarily mean that your child is afraid of their co-parent or that seeing their co-parent is damaging for them, any more than it means that going to school would be damaging for your child. Now, definitely there are circumstances in which you have a parent who is abusive, and if that parent is abusive, then I wouldn't term the child's anxiety of going to see that person as separation anxiety. I would just say that it's anxiety about seeing somebody who's abusive, and often the two are conflated. It also doesn't mean that they don't have any bond to the parent that they're going to be seeing, depending especially on the age of the child. If they're only seeing their other biological parent infrequently, then they are more comfortable, more bonded, perhaps to the biological parent with whom they spend most of the time, and so that's their primary caregiver and of course they're going to have anxiety leaving the primary caregiver. That doesn't mean that the fix to that problem is to see the non-primary caregiver less. It doesn't mean that they have less visitation with the other parent. What it means is that you work on a way to decrease that separation anxiety over time, and so that's kind of a preview for what we're going to talk about today, just as a brief recap from last time.

Speaker 1: 2:55

Separation anxiety is just a really common experience for children and it represents a deep attachment that they have to the primary caregiver. This kind of anxiety is perfectly developmentally normal, especially in young kids, and it can come up in new uncertain transitions, like if you're going to preschool or going to kindergarten, going to a friend's home for the first time for a sleepover, having a visitation transfer to see the non-custodial parent. These are circumstances in which separation anxiety can flare up and maybe be more symptomatic than it might otherwise be. Now, separation anxiety generally centers around a child's fear of being away from their primary caregiver, and that can include worry about their own safety and it can include worry about how their parents are going to be. You know how that can include worry about their own safety and it can include worry about how their parents are going to be. You know how that caregiver is going to be when the child is away from them. Part of what causes this anxiety is a child's comfort level with what's routine for them. Now, when you have separated families, what is routine will change. That can make it difficult for kids to settle in fully with either parent Transitions in custody schedules or even their daily routines can really serve to heighten their anxiety, and so extra attention needs to be paid to how these transitions are done and how both parents, but especially the primary custodian, is approaching preparing the child for the visitation transfer.

Speaker 1: 4:26

So a topic that very often comes up is you know, what does it mean about how my child is feeling, what their emotional state is and really how they feel about the other parent if they're displaying separation anxiety at transfers? And I do want to reiterate, and have you thinking throughout this conversation about separation anxiety that children feel when going to school, for example. It really is essentially the same thing. From my perspective, when a child experiences separation anxiety, it's kind of a sign of a couple things it's a sign of their attachment to the primary caregiver and it's a sign of vulnerability. Your child may cling to you or cry, they may have physical symptoms like stomach aches or headaches, especially when they're starting to anticipate that that separation is about to occur, and these behaviors and these symptoms highlight the sense of uncertainty that they have and the need that they're expressing for reassurance that everything's going to be okay. So your child's worry is typically going to be about the possibility of something happening to their parent, about them getting lost in the shuffle between the houses. Their parent may forget them, not come get them and pick them up later. These are very common worries that a child could have and these are very similar worries to what a child will feel when they get dropped off for school.

Speaker 1: 5:53

It doesn't mean that there is a lack of a bond between the child and the non-custodial parent. It doesn't mean that the non-custodial parent is unsafe or is abusing the child. It's not appropriate to infer from the presence of separation anxiety that there's something wrong with the other parent or that there's something wrong in the relationship between the other parent and your child. It's a bridge too far to think that you know that there's so many potential alternate causes for how a child is feeling that a primary custodian who's sort of cherry-picking. The idea that there's something wrong with the other parent is really, I think, engaging in some self-serving logic, especially if your relationship with your other parent is poor. You may even just subconsciously be looking for reasons to think that the visit shouldn't happen or it shouldn't be as long or it shouldn't be an overnight visit.

Speaker 1: 6:53

But just like it would be irresponsible for a parent to not send their child to school because the child's experiencing separation anxiety, it's inappropriate for a primary custodian to interfere with the child's visitation with the other parent because of their separation anxiety. School is important for a child. They need that socialization, they need the education, all of that. You send your child to school despite separation anxiety, because it's important for them, it's necessary for their development. You should send your child on visitations, even if they're experiencing separation anxiety, because it's important for the development of the relationship with their co-parent. It's important for their emotional and psychological health to develop a strong, consistent relationship with both parents. As irresponsible as it would be to not send your child to school because they experience separation anxiety, it would be just as irresponsible and harmful for your child to not send them for visitation with a safe co-parent just because they're experiencing separation anxiety.

Speaker 1: 7:58

Often, without even realizing it, the custodial parent may engage in behaviors that unintentionally make a child's separation anxiety worse, and here's some examples. You could over-reassure your child. So constantly reassuring children that everything's going to be fine can sometimes actually make them worry more. Overprotective behavior can make a child feel like the situation is actually dangerous or something to be concerned about. If the routines are not consistent, that also can make things worse. If the visitation schedule changes frequently, that change can exacerbate a child's sense of the unpredictability of the visitation, which can add to their anxiety. Consistency in the schedule helps a child know what to expect and feel secure. That also goes with having some visitation transfer rituals that you do. Consistent routines aren't just the date and time when a visitation transfer happens, it's how and where the transfer is conducted.

Speaker 1: 9:01

If you've heard many of our podcasts, you may have heard me already talk about the long goodbye. Having a long emotional goodbye, a drawn-out farewell, where you are showing your own anxiety and your concern for your child. That will make your child's anxiety worse. Kids are constantly scanning their parents for cues about how they should feel. So if you're crying, if your face is all scrunched up with worry, if your body language is really tense, if your voice is different than it normally is because you're upset, all of those are going to be cues to your child that they should be upset. They don't know enough about the world to know often when they should or shouldn't be upset. They look to you to help them understand when they should be upset, when they should be calm. A long, emotional, drawn-out, emotionally fraught farewell is giving your child an undeniable signal that they should be upset.

Speaker 1: 10:02

Your visitation transfer exchange should be much like your school exchange. You know, when you have a young kid and you're driving them through the drop-off line, a teacher comes or the aid comes, they open up the door, they get the child out, they go. That is a professional, business-like, safe exchange. There's no reason why a visitation transfer exchange shouldn't be similar. Now, I understand that parents often don't want the other parent opening their door to let the child in or let the child out, so don't get hung up on that detail. But the idea is that the visitation transfer should be quick, efficient and immemorable. You don't want them to carry memories of difficult visitation transfers. That's not going to help anybody. If you want to learn more about visitation transfers, there's a few sources I can point you to. One source is Podcast Episode 16, visitation Transfer 2-4. That would be helpful to look back at our podcast 16. Also, we have a lesson in our Co-Parent Academy about Visitation Transfers. So if you wanted a really deep dive into Visitation Transfers, you could check out our Visitation Transfer course at Co-Parent Academy. It's $35 on demand and it goes into how to properly conduct visitation transfers at every developmental stage.

Speaker 1: 11:31

All right, so we've talked about a few ways in which parents can make that separation anxiety worse. Here's some ways in which parents can ease their child separation anxiety. One maintain consistent routines. So if you keep drop-offs short and consistent and calm, that's huge. When a child knows that the drop-off process is going to be predictable and quick, it helps them adjust more readily. So you come up with a tradition about how you do the visitation transfers. You keep it simple and you stick to that routine even if your child seems distressed at first. That consistency over time will bring your child comfort. Also, it helps to validate their feelings.

Speaker 1: 12:13

So if you help your child understand that feeling anxious about being apart from you is normal, then that can help them Acknowledging their feelings without dwelling on them, right? So you say something like it's okay to feel a little sad when we say goodbye, but we're going to see each other really soon. That can help normalize the experience. You're acknowledging that they feel anxious or nervous. You're putting words to the feeling which, if you recall from a previous episode, helps take that emotion out of the primitive brain, the downstairs brain, and it helps bring it up into the thinking brain because you're using the logical part of your brain to put that label on the feeling. It helps reduce the impact of the feeling. So help them normalize the experience by labeling and validating their feelings.

Speaker 1: 13:06

Next, don't enable avoidance. You know, if you allow your child to skip visits or, you know, prolong the transfer to sort of indulge the anxiety that they're displaying, that seems like something that might be a quick fix. You know, it seems like, oh, that takes care of the immediate problem, but really what it does is it makes the problem worse. It actually increases that anxiety. So instead, encourage your child to be brave, right, reinforce that you know that they're capable of handling short separations. You can say something like oh, I know it's hard, but you're so strong and you're going to be okay, you're going to have a great time with your other parent. That kind of thing can be empowering. You can also have transition objects like a stuffed animal or a small toy from one home to the other. It can be something that has the smell of your household. If your house smells amazing, having a toy in your house that smells like your home can help reassure your child on the trip. Let them take a photograph of you, let them take something that comforts them and helps them understand that you're still around, that you're going to be there, that other house still exists and they're going to be going back to it. Having that kind of transition object can bridge the gap between the two households and that gives them something physical to hang on to, to remind them of their connection to each of you. One thing that can be really helpful is to develop some positive rituals or affirmations before transition, and my thought about this is these kinds of rituals or affirmations should be done before you get in the car for the transfer. So you know, maybe you have a saying that you do.

Speaker 1: 14:53

There is a podcast called Charm Words, which I really, really like. Charm Words is a podcast. It didn't used to have any ads, but now it's starting to get some advertisements. It's from American Public Media and the title is Charm Words Daily Affirmations for Kids, and my wife Rebecca and I often listen to these and do the daily affirmations together, just because it's a great way to start your day. It only takes like three or four minutes to do. It's got some breathing exercises with it. It has one simple concept that the affirmation is going to be about a little bit of context for it. Then you do the affirmation, you do the breathing and at the end you do a high five and you roll on with your day, and that kind of thing could be really helpful to help a child get over their separation anxiety.

Speaker 1: 15:41

You could come up with that sort of charm words, podcast type daily affirmation or visitation affirmation where you have a conversation with them. Just really quick one thing I love you, you're going to have a great time, you're going to be back soon. Breathe a little bit together. You do a high five at the end. That kind of thing could be really helpful for a child and can be a really positive ritual that helps them not only with the separation anxiety but models for them some things that you can do when you're feeling anxious about anything, because your child is going to feel anxious about separations. They're going to feel anxious when they're with you. They're going to feel anxious when they're not with you. So modeling for your child some things that they can do when they're feeling anxious and you're not with them. It's actually good for them too. Another thing that you can do is just gradually expose them to the transfer. So, especially if your child has some intense separation anxiety, helping them gradually adjust to the transfer can be very helpful.

Speaker 1: 16:41

And this is sometimes hard for the non-custodial parent to sort of accept. You know, from their perspective. The non-custodial parent knows that they're safe, they know they're going to have a good time with their child once the transfer is over and the child settles in. Very often the non-custodial parent feels like the separation anxiety is just manufactured by the custodial parent to try to interfere with their parenting time. And sometimes that's true. I've definitely seen circumstances in which parents take the concept of separation anxiety and weaponize it to try to interfere with the non-custodial parent's parenting time. But there are just as many, if not more, circumstances in which a child legitimately has separation anxiety in multiple aspects of their life because they're an anxious child. When that's the case and when the anxiety is not being weaponized, then it especially makes sense for the non-custodial parent to work together with the custodial parent to come up with a graduated process for these visits. Remember the graduated process for these visits. Remember.

Speaker 1: 17:46

The big part of the fear that the child has is they're worried about something happening to the custodial parent while they're gone. And they're worried about something happening to them Like maybe they will get forgotten or they won't be brought back to the place where they normally live. A way to help your child get out of the state of anxiety is to show them little, little by little, that there's not a need to be anxious. It's like any other time that you're building up trust. You start with small things, things that don't carry a lot of weight, or if there's a problem, it's not the end of the world, and you can slowly build up trust to larger and larger and larger situations. And you can slowly build up trust to larger and larger and larger situations.

Speaker 1: 18:23

When our son started being old enough to be left alone, we didn't start by going away for the day and coming back. We started by driving away from the house and staying in the neighborhood for 10 or 15 minutes. Then we lengthened it. Maybe we would go to the grocery store. That's about 10 minutes away. Then you lengthen it, you lengthen the time. You can increase the distance. As you do that, you're making adjustments, you're finding out where the issues are Figuring out. Can this, you know, could our child be trusted, being home alone? Little by little, you're building up your trust in them and their trust in themselves.

Speaker 1: 19:05

The same thing happens with visitation transfers. You could start by having the non-custodial parent come over and just hang out at the house, maybe outside or maybe in a different room. Then a small visit. Maybe they walk to the park. When I'm a guardian ad litem, I'll go and I'll do home visits and very often I'll take the child on a walk. It's in their neighborhood, we're just walking through the street. It gives us a chance to be able to speak privately, but it's also in public and we're moving. You know that movement, I think, helps Also because it's the child's neighborhood. Depending on how old they are, I let them sort of direct where they go.

Speaker 1: 19:49

No-transcript. So you could have that be a next step in the process. Maybe just go through a walk in the neighborhood. If there's a park nearby, maybe walk to the park, not even getting in a car, just going for a walk. Then you build up to short visits involving a car with transfer. Maybe it's 30 minutes, maybe it's an hour, nothing major. You know nothing major. It's very brief. And they see oh, I am going to come back, I am going to be safe while I'm gone. You just gradually build it up over time. It may take weeks, it may take a month, it may take a couple months, depending on the child, to sort of expand that out.

Speaker 1: 20:28

There's some benefits to this for the non-custodial parent too. Often what you'll find is that if you're dragging this process out a little bit too long, the child's going to get tired of it. They're going to let you know that they want to stay with you longer, that they want to stay overnight, but they don't want to come back so quickly. That could start to hurt the custodial parent kind of in the feelings. They think to themselves oh, my kid doesn't want to come back. You know what does that mean about a relationship? It really just means that it's healthy. You know that they're starting to really appreciate their relationship with the other parent and so they don't necessarily need to be tied to your hip all the time. That's a great sign of development for your child and their ability to deal with the world in general, not just having visits with the other parent.

Speaker 1: 21:16

So separation anxiety, visitations can definitely be a topic that's challenging In the moment. It can feel devastating to see your child so upset, but you have to understand that they don't understand right. You have to know that their feelings are big feelings but they're not necessarily for real reasons. It's something that's real to the child because it's the world as they perceive it. But you have a better perspective on the world because you've lived longer. You have more experience. So don't get yourself dragged down to the level of their understanding of the world. Don't encourage them to not be brave and step out into the world and learn to experience new things. That makes it easier on you because you don't hear their crying in the moment, but it's worse for them because they're not getting the development that they deserve. They're not getting the experiences that they deserve and, in the context of visitation transfers, they're not building up relationships that they deserve to have.

Speaker 1: 22:18

It's important to focus, as you're helping your child get over separation anxiety, on consistency, empathy and positive reinforcement. Now, if we use those tools, we can help our kids transition more easily, easily. The goal is for your child to feel safe and supported, for them to know that both parents love them and care for them, that they're safe with both parents, that both parents are there for them, regardless of which home that they're in. Many times, conversations about separation anxiety with visitation transfers become very heated. They're really emotionally triggering. They can carry with them a lot of baggage from the relationship between the parents. That's really sad for the kids when that occurs.

Speaker 1: 23:04

Instead, if yours is a case in which there is not abuse what I mean is if this is not a case in which the court has found that the other parent is a danger to the child and has implemented safeguards it's just sort of a normal custody and visitation situation Then I encourage you to remove your feelings from the situation. I encourage you to not mind-read your child and think that you know exactly what they're thinking or feeling. Because you don't think that you know exactly what they're thinking or feeling, because you don't Mind read the other parent, because if you're in a high conflict situation, it's likely you're going to be ascribing to the other parent negative thoughts and emotions that they don't actually have. That's unhelpful as well. Instead, what I encourage you to do is to look at separation anxiety and visitation transfers as an opportunity to strengthen your co-parenting relationship. The non-custodial parent to take their ego out of the way and not be offended by the fact that maybe your child has some separation anxiety.

Speaker 1: 24:10

For the custodial parent to deal with the emotions and the physical symptoms even that your child may be displaying and understand that it's actually best for them to be able to work up in a quick way to having these visitations with the other parent. So if both parents can put their stuff aside, focus on their child, be professional and businesslike in how they accomplish the task of assisting their child out of the stage of separation anxiety, then lots of good things will flow from that. Your co-parenting relationship will improve because you've met together over a complicated topic and little by little, you've built up some trust. That's always going to be helpful. You're going to help your child because you're teaching them important life lessons, not just about visitation transfers. You're helping them experience anxiety. You're giving them tools to deal with the anxiety that they're feeling. You're helping them learn that if they step out bravely, then they're going to be rewarded with new and hopefully great experiences, providing them the opportunity to have as good a relationship as possible with both parents, which is something that they desperately crave and that they desperately need.

Speaker 1: 25:30

So I encourage all parents out there who are dealing with separation anxiety and visitation transfers to focus on what we all know is best for your child. If you get hung up thinking about this being the other parent that you're dealing with, someone that you may not like at all, try to focus on the parallel between visitation transfers and dropping a child off at kindergarten for the first time. School and a relationship with their parent are important developmentally, emotionally, psychologically, educationally for your child. If you interfere with your child's visitation with your other parent because your child's displaying separation anxiety, that is no better than you interfering with their schooling, because they show separation anxiety when you drop them off for school. Just like your child needs the socialization and education that they receive at school, your child needs the relationship that you're preventing them from having with the non-custodial parent. So, everybody, please take this as an opportunity to work together for the benefit of your child, building trust and their resilience along the way. Thank you, everybody. I hope you have a fantastic week. Take care.